Waldron Career Conversation with Rachel Shine ’13: Social Worker and Therapist
Rachel Shine graduated from Weinberg College in 2013 with a major in English. She later pursued a Masters in Social Work and she is currently a therapist in her own private practice.
We talk about a defining experience at Northwestern that led her to pursue a career in therapy, the various aspects to her work that she enjoys and finds challenging, along with her recommendations for self-care during this particularly challenging time.
Cassie Petoskey (00:00):
Welcome to the Weinberg In The World podcast, where we bring you stories of interdisciplinary thinking for today's complex world. This episode is an alumni career chat, brought to you by the Waldron Student-Alumni Connections Program. Today we're speaking with Rachel Shine, who graduated from Weinberg College in 2013 with a major in English. Rachel later pursued a master's in social work, and she's currently a therapist in her own private practice. Rachel, thanks so much for joining us today.
Rachel Shine (00:28):
Thanks so much for having me. I'm so excited to talk today.
Cassie Petoskey (00:30):
Yeah. And we're looking forward to hearing more about your current work and what you're up to as a therapist. But before getting into that, I was hoping you could tell us a little bit more about your Northwestern experience on campus.
Rachel Shine (00:43):
Yeah, absolutely. So at Northwestern, I actually started out as a theater major. I had done theater all throughout middle school and high school, and I just really loved acting. But as soon as I got to Northwestern, I started feeling uncertain about it just as my kind of ultimate career path, just because it's not such a guaranteed major in that sense.
(01:09):
So after just a few weeks at Northwestern, I switched to Weinberg and I was an English Lit major. So during my time at Northwestern, I mostly focused on writing. I did a lot of playwriting and screenwriting festivals and classes there, and I was hoping to become a writer of some kind. So the summer before my senior year of college, I received a Weinberg grant for the summer that allowed me to spend those few months researching and writing a screenplay.
(01:44):
And it was that summer that kind of shifted my career path, I'd say, because I realized that I really loved doing the research for the screenplay, which kind of entailed me sitting with different people and hearing their stories and kind of noticing that sense of relief that they felt when they were able to kind of unburden themselves by telling their personal stories.
(02:11):
But then I also noticed that I really hated the time when I had to sit by myself and write. That was kind of the time that I dreaded the most. So when I came back to college my senior year, I started just brainstorming different jobs that would allow me to work with other people since I apparently hated kind of being on my own in that way. And also jobs that would allow me to connect with people and hear their stories.
(02:37):
So that's really how I narrowed down my options to be a therapist. And it's something that I tell my clients a lot now who are trying to either have a major job change in their life, or kind of college students or younger adults who are trying to figure out what job works for them just to really consider your values and how you like to spend your time. And that's how I was able to pick the career path that was actually the obvious career path for me all along, even though I didn't realize it at the time.
Cassie Petoskey (03:12):
And so you started to realize some of the things you were passionate about while you were in college. When you were, I know something that really is a stressor for current college students is the picking of the major, and when you were picking English, how did that influence how you saw your future job, career path, your job prospects?
Rachel Shine (03:37):
Yeah.
Cassie Petoskey (03:37):
And then when did you start thinking about your next step as graduate school?
Rachel Shine (03:43):
Yeah. Yeah. That's a great question. So I think being an English Literature major, in terms of my career afterwards, I was on the track of, "Oh, well, I guess I could either be a writer or a teacher." And I guess, the Teach For America program was also big at Northwestern.
(04:05):
So kind of juggling those different options in my mind because I felt like that was the set path for an English Lit major. But when I started to think more broadly about it, I just started to appreciate that being an English major just allowed me to really think critically and thoughtfully, and also allowed me to place myself easily into someone else's shoes.
(04:29):
And that those were great skills that I could bring to a bunch of other career paths, including being a therapist. So I was just challenging myself not to limit myself to that set path, but instead to just think of really the skills that it provided me with. And that allowed me to kind of breathe a sigh of relief when I was able to open myself up to kind of more opportunities.
Cassie Petoskey (04:52):
Yeah, definitely. And I think or I'm curious when you decided that you wanted to go to grad school that you were like, "These are some of the ways that I can use the skills that I learned in undergrad," tell us more about going back to grad school and how your perspective of your career shifted while you were in grad school.
Rachel Shine (05:16):
Yeah. Well, even to get to the point of me going to grad school, I actually took two years off before, and I joined this program that I think would be nice for students to know about. It's called Children's Corp. And it's kind of like a Teach For America program, but for social work. So I applied to that when I was in my senior year of college.
(05:37):
And I, it's based in New York, and so I went to New York for two years after college. And what they do is they basically provide you with this training over the summer at Columbia's School of Social Work. And then they place, there's a cohort of about 40 of us, and they placed us all at different foster care agencies throughout the city where we were each assigned to be foster care case workers at these agencies.
(06:02):
And then we would have monthly check-ins with each other to kind of support each other throughout the process. So that was a helpful step for me in terms of moving towards grad school because it kind of solidified in my mind the idea that I definitely wanted to be a social worker. I definitely loved doing therapy with clients.
(06:20):
I definitely loved kind of seeing all these systems come into play and interacting with the families and the children and the court system and all the kind of this crazy stuff that comes with the world of foster care. So after doing that for two years, I felt kind of even more certain about my path. I couldn't even consider other options because I was just so excited about the work that I had been doing.
(06:46):
So I ended up coming back to Chicago and I went to the University of Chicago's master's program for social work. And during that program, you do internships each year where you're working in the field doing social work in different ways. So I spent one year working with people who are experiencing homelessness, kind of working in the field with them, doing case work and counseling with them.
(07:14):
And then I spent another year at the children's hospital here doing kind of counseling and grief work with a bunch of families. And I think all of that even ties back to the time at Northwestern because social work is so broad in many ways. So I was jumping from foster care to homelessness, to hospital work and grief work. And similar to my path at Northwestern, kind of jumping all around.
(07:41):
But you take kind of key skills, key strengths from all of these different experiences. And rather than feeling as if I was limiting myself by being on one path for one year and a different path for another year, it kind of helped me appreciate the similarities between all these different experiences and the parts of it that I really appreciated and wanted to pursue more along my career path.
Cassie Petoskey (08:08):
And like you mentioned, you were able to do a lot of different things within the social work therapeutic field, like you said, foster care, homelessness, in the children's hospital. How did you evaluate what pieces of those experiences you enjoyed and how did that influence what you're now doing?
Rachel Shine (08:28):
Yeah. Yeah. That's a great question. I think I really loved working with the families in foster care kind of the most out of all my work. And so similarly, I loved working with the families that I met at the hospital. I liked all of the kind of family systems and family dynamics at play.
(08:50):
I loved the idea that I wasn't just interacting with one person at a particular point of their life, but that they had had so many experiences before and afterwards and with all these different relationships in their family that it kind of made me appreciate how complex people's experiences are and to always meet people where they're at instead of making my own assumptions about what they need or what I could provide.
(09:19):
So I think it helped to shape my perspective in that way. And right now I do individual therapy, so I don't really work with families as much. But I think I just always like to keep that perspective of the complexity of people's experiences and kind of appreciating that the person who's sitting in front of me was influenced by many generations of their family and had certain childhood experiences that shaped who they are today. So even though I'm not doing family therapy right now, I kind of just like to hold that perspective in my mind, which I did learn from my experiences in grad school.
Cassie Petoskey (09:54):
And you mentioned you're doing individual therapy, and I'd love to hear more about the day to day work and what that entails, because a lot of what we do through the Waldron Student-Alumni Connections Program is help students explore these different career options.
(10:11):
And I think social work, like you said, is such a broad field. You can do a lot of different things within that. So I'd love to hear more about your day to day as a therapist. And then also, I know you just started your own practice, and I'm wondering how that shifted your day to day even more.
Rachel Shine (10:30):
Yeah, absolutely. I was working in a group practice prior to opening up my own private practice. So that group practice, I was working with adults of all ages. But mostly I'd say young adults and kind of college students was what I enjoyed the most. At that private practice we saw a whole range of different kind of presenting issues from depression to grief to anxiety to even couples therapy, relationship stressors, kind of everything.
(11:03):
But what's been really nice about starting my own practice is I've kind of gotten to decide my own schedule. Having your own private practice is, of course, very independent and very flexible. So that's really wonderful. And I've also gotten to decide kind of what population I like to work with the most, and also what focuses I feel that I'm best suited for and that I enjoy the most. So right now, I'm still mostly seeing young adults.
(11:33):
I'm working in Evanston, not far from the Northwestern campus. But what I've kind of learned throughout my whole time practicing social work is that I like kind of working with anxiety the most, and also trauma the most with a focus on sexual assault. And that's just from a bunch of different work experiences that I've had since graduating college.
(11:59):
And it's been really nice for me because I feel like now I'm able to specialize a little bit more, which is great. So there's many upsides of private practice. Again, my days are very flexible and independent. I make my own schedule. I can decide when I get to see clients. I do a lot of professional development training courses and a lot of networking.
(12:20):
But there's also definite downsides, which is just that I'm on my own a lot. And I'm sure a lot of therapists will appreciate that you're rarely kind of talking about yourself because you're just talking to all these clients about kind of their own stuff going on. So in that sense, in terms of my day to day life, I've realized that it's really important for me to connect to the community in Evanston and to other therapists there, because otherwise it can get a little isolating, for sure.
Cassie Petoskey (12:48):
Yeah, definitely important to evaluate those, the pros and cons and how to adapt to that. That was one of my main questions for you is kind of the challenges that you help your clients through, and then also the challenges that you personally face through social work and therapy.
(13:08):
And it sounds like some of those things might, you're working through anxiety and trauma with clients and also finding a way to feel connected to a community. Can you walk us through some of the ways that you help your clients through these challenges and then also help yourself stay connected?
Rachel Shine (13:25):
Yeah, absolutely. I think that in terms of experiencing anxiety and some of those stressors, I like to use cognitive behavioral therapy in my practice. So that's kind of just the idea that our thoughts impact our feelings, which then impact our behavior, which is pretty straightforward connection, of course.
(13:48):
But we don't pay enough attention to kind of the power that our thoughts have, I think, over all of this. So the idea behind that is basically if an incident occurs, such as a student getting a bad grade on their exam, an automatic thought pops up, which could be, "I'm such a failure. I'm so stupid. Now I'm never going to get the job that I want."
(14:13):
Right? The thoughts could spiral and spiral and spiral and be super negative. And those thoughts can impact the students feelings by starting to feel really anxious, feel really down, feel really depressed, whatever that might be. And then those feelings could impact the students behavior such as maybe they start to withdraw from social activities.
(14:35):
Maybe they are having trouble sleeping, having trouble eating, right? Such a variety of different behaviors that could result. So what we work on in my practice in particular is kind of catching that automatic thought that comes up. Right? We often can't change the incident that occurs.
(14:51):
Right? Sometimes we get a bad grade, right? Different things happen in life, but we can catch our automatic thought that pops up. And before we let it have that domino effect of spiraling into affecting our feelings, affecting our behavior, to catch the thought, to examine it, right? To ask, "How truthful is this thought?" Right? "Am I really this stupid?
(15:10):
Am I really not going to get the job I want because of this one grade that I got?" And then to try to replace the thought with a more helpful thought that would be kind of better suited for the situation. So you're not trying to lie to yourself. You still want the thought to be genuine, right? But you can kind of place another thought on your mind that might be more helpful and more beneficial in the end.
(15:30):
So maybe the thought would be, "This is just one exam, I'm going to do better in the next one. This is just a passing moment." Right? And then kind of seeing if I'm placing that thought on my mind, how does this impact my mood now? How does this impact my behavior now? And it's a pretty powerful practice.
(15:47):
I know a lot of therapists use it with their clients. And it's really effective because you're starting to kind of rewire how your mind is working so that at first, it's a lot of work to catch your thoughts, change your thoughts, but it eventually becomes kind of a habitual practice.
(16:05):
And my clients have found that it really helps them in terms of decreasing their anxiety or decreasing their depression. And back to how it impacts me, I do the same thing in my life, right? I practice what I preach, and I think it's really helpful in terms of me connecting with my clients where I can kind of go through these tools and these processes with them to see how effective it is for myself so that I really am kind of teaching them what I know, right? And learning from them as well.
Cassie Petoskey (16:36):
I really appreciate you walking us through your process. And I was curious from the beginning when you had mentioned that you had always done theater and you had this creative side to you in writing, and I was wondering how you still use that creativity in your work. And it seems like every process, the process is the same, but every issue and thought is different, and you have to be creative in how you adapt to it.
Rachel Shine (17:01):
Yeah, that's a great way to put it. That's really true.
Cassie Petoskey (17:04):
Yeah.
Rachel Shine (17:04):
Yeah.
Cassie Petoskey (17:04):
Yeah. Which is so interesting and definitely leads me into my next question for you about what you really enjoy in your work and what's your favorite part of your job.
Rachel Shine (17:17):
Yeah. I think just even starting from when I was working in foster care, I was just struck by how privileged I felt to be included in all of these different people's lives and how invested I was in just kind of following along with how their lives unfolded. I mean, in foster care, I was actually entering people's homes and really getting to see the world in which they lived. Right? And I just felt so honored to be able to do that.
(17:48):
But even now in private practice, I mean, yes, people are coming to me in my office, which is a little different, but I am just so excited for them to come and to hear what happened in the last week, how did that conversation with so and so go, what happened with their job. Right? I mean, I'm kind of watching their lives unfold as this witness with them. And to me, it just feels like kind of the greatest honor. And it never gets old. I'm never tired of it. It's always interesting moment to moment. So I feel very, very lucky in that way.
Cassie Petoskey (18:26):
And I'm sure every day is different, every meeting with your clients is different than what you may even imagine, right?
Rachel Shine (18:34):
Absolutely. Yeah. And it takes some, I think, a certain skill for a therapist to be able to have a skill set, certain knowledge, certain maybe theories that they practice with, but also being able to leave all of that at the door and just meet the client with whatever they're coming in with and really not planning an agenda too much, but instead kind of going along with the rollercoaster ride with them in session. And it's hard to relinquish control like that, but I think it's really beneficial in the end.
Cassie Petoskey (19:06):
That definitely seems like it could be mentally taxing, but definitely, like you said, enjoyable to help along the way and witness the positive changes in people's lives.
Rachel Shine (19:20):
Absolutely.
Cassie Petoskey (19:21):
And my final question for you, Rachel, is around your expertise. And I know our, I'm working with Weinberg College students and the arts and sciences around career exploration, but there's a lot going on while we're in college. There's the stressors of coursework and finding the job and landing some, landing the job and all of that.
(19:46):
We're also going through a crazy time in the world with a global pandemic, and there are those additional stressors that we are learning to live with. And I'm curious what your recommendations are for folks trying to handle all of the uncertainty going on in the world right now.
Rachel Shine (20:08):
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think that uncertainty makes us feel like we're out of control, whether it's the uncertainty of the job search and the job market or of the global pandemic right now. So because of that feeling like we're out of control, we want to do anything that we can to help us regain a sense of control, even if it's in really small ways.
(20:33):
So I think keeping a routine, especially right now, is really helpful. I know a lot of the students are kind of at home, not living in the dorms anymore, maybe not having the same class schedule, but I think right now, still waking up at the same time every day that we have been before coronavirus happened is helpful.
(20:54):
Writing out a schedule for the day so that you have that feeling, that satisfying feeling of kind of crossing things off your list. Even if you're kind of maybe feeling a little down and wanting to do something indulgent, like binge Netflix or something, kind of setting aside a time to do that so that it's kind of indulgence within structure, I think is really helpful.
(21:19):
I think setting boundaries always is a good thing, but especially right now, boundaries in terms of kind of how we're consuming news, how we're communicating with others. I know it can, hours can fly by with us just reading all about coronavirus or texting or Zooming with different people. And I think it's helpful to kind of set boundaries in terms of how much we want to engage with all of these different things.
(21:49):
And then I think always, but especially right now, getting outside is helpful to walk around, of course. But that, while you're doing that, practicing some active mindfulness is always beneficial. I think people sometimes are scared of the concept of mindfulness because it sounds like kind of boring meditation where you have to sit alone and try not to think of anything, right? And just be pretty serious.
(22:12):
But I really like the idea of active mindfulness instead, especially for young adults, because it's more of the idea of say right now if you're going for a walk outside to get some exercise, being really present with your thoughts so that you're kind of just paying attention on purpose. So you're thinking to yourself, "I feel the ground underneath my feet.
(22:35):
I'm noticing this person pass me by. I'm noticing how the wind feels on my face. I'm noticing the temperature of the air." Right? To kind of just tune your brain in to be super present and super mindful, even if it's just for a few moments. It really grounds us in our bodies and can really kind of calm our thoughts and settle us, which I think is so important during uncertain times, especially right now. Yeah. So I hope that all of those tips are helpful.
Cassie Petoskey (23:09):
Yeah, absolutely. Like you said, yeah, each tip that you gave, it's like these are always helpful things for handling uncertainty, whatever it is in your life. And hopefully these will be helpful now as well as into the future as students are handling various things that come up.
(23:30):
Definitely I have to constantly tell myself right now to be present and to be where I'm at and to be noticing what is going on around me here right now, not in these potential futures that we don't know what that might look like yet.
Rachel Shine (23:48):
Absolutely. Absolutely. It prevents us from kind of spiraling down that rabbit hole, right? Yeah. And instead grounds us in the present. Yeah. No, I think that's great.
Cassie Petoskey (23:57):
Great reminders, really helpful. And kind of along the similar lines, Rachel, similar to getting outside, what are some recommendations that you have for self care? What do you enjoy using? What are some of the tools you use? And then what else? What are some other ideas folks should consider to really take care of themselves?
Rachel Shine (24:20):
Yeah, absolutely. I think the first and foremost right now is being compassionate with ourselves. So maybe not having the most strict expectations for ourselves right now, and kind of acknowledging that this is a particularly hard time. So if we need a few extra moments in bed or we want to watch a TV show or something, right? Anything to make ourselves feel good, that that's okay right now.
(24:49):
And that, again, like you said, this is just a passing moment and that this is not how our lives will always be. I think in terms of more tangible self care practices, I'm a big yoga person. So I normally have practiced yoga most days before kind of being stuck inside, but I'm still continuing to do that now. And I think that can be said for any kind of physical activity, right? Whatever you were doing before, kind of making it possible for yourself now, just to kind of retain that sense of normalcy.
(25:22):
And also, of course, just moving your body, releasing those endorphins, that always feels good. And then I think it's different levels for everyone, of course, but connection in some way is important. I think it can be easy right now to kind of spiral into that isolation, right? And kind of not move from your couch, not really engage with others, right? Kind of just isolate on your own.
(25:51):
But I think in terms of self care, connection is so important always. And now more than ever. So whether it's just checking in with someone who you know maybe lives alone and could use a check-in, whether it's texting with some friends, Zooming with people, going for a walk, and staying a safe distance away from other people. I think all of that is really helpful and that it really fills us up in a way that nothing else really has the power to.
Cassie Petoskey (26:22):
Yeah, definitely. I love those tips and the ideas for staying connected. It's so interesting. For me personally at this time, I feel like I'm connecting with my family even more so now because I want to check in. So that's been a really interesting positive throughout all of this craziness.
(26:46):
I feel like it's bringing me together with some friends and family that I don't typically stay in touch with on a consistent basis. And now I'm like, okay, I know people are at home going through, we're all going through this tough time. So staying connected. I have daily calls with my sister.
Rachel Shine (27:06):
Yeah. Yeah, [inaudible 00:27:07] great.
Cassie Petoskey (27:08):
And some of things.
Rachel Shine (27:09):
And I do think, yeah, it's a silver lining of all of this. But also hopefully it's something that we, after this passes, that we no longer take for granted, right? just that connection with others and these relationships that, I mean, technology makes it so easy for us to continue the connection, so why would we not?
Cassie Petoskey (27:28):
Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. And I know that's something we've been talking a lot about at Northwestern, is just how our community is coming together through this. And hopefully that will be something that we can continue to do through the future with students who are going through different stressors down the road, whether it's coursework or career related, that we can support each other in these new ways. We have tools to stay connected that we didn't know we had.
Rachel Shine (27:58):
Right, Right. Absolutely.
Cassie Petoskey (27:59):
Yes, definitely. Rachel, I really appreciate you sharing all these great tips and more about your work. It's really interesting to hear how you evaluated while in college, how the different things that you enjoyed and how that kind of later turned into a really fulfilling career.
(28:16):
And I know we're going to have you speak with more students in later in April around helping careers, which will be a really fun program. But do you have anything else that you want to add? Any other insights or advice for students in general that you want to leave them with?
Rachel Shine (28:34):
I think just what I said at the beginning in terms of if students are trying to focus on their careers right now, thinking about maybe even making a list of your values or a list of kind of how you like to spend your time during the day and kind of working backwards in that way in terms of figuring out the right career for you.
(28:52):
I think it's a really nice exercise and is easier than it even sounds. And then I also think just in terms of right now, any students who feel like they are especially anxious or struggling in any way right now to just reach out to therapists. Most therapists now are doing phone sessions or Zoom sessions. They're all accessible online now. And I think mental health now more than ever is super important. So don't be afraid to reach out.
Cassie Petoskey (29:22):
Absolutely. That's a great point, Rachel. And I know the university CAPS program, they have lots of great resources.
Rachel Shine (29:30):
Yeah.
Cassie Petoskey (29:30):
So we'll definitely share that out in the show notes to this podcast. And I really appreciate you encouraging that to reach out when you need help. And Northwestern has those great resources, which is awesome. And Rachel, I love how you kind of talk us through not only listing your values, but how you enjoy spending your time, because I know career thinking about a job or a career path is, there's just so much there. And to really simplify it down to what you enjoy doing I think is a great way to think about it and to start having that internal dialogue for yourself.
Rachel Shine (30:09):
Yeah. I hope it's a helpful exercise. Absolutely.
Cassie Petoskey (30:12):
Definitely. And Rachel, thank you so much for sharing all that you did today. We really appreciate it. And thank you to everyone for tuning in.
Rachel Shine (30:22):
Yeah. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it.
Cassie Petoskey (30:26):
For more information about Weinberg College and this podcast, please visit weinberg.northwestern.edu and search for Waldron. Also, we'd love to hear your feedback. Please email us at waldron@northwestern.edu with your thoughts on today's program. Thank you again for tuning into this episode of Weinberg In The World.